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Please keep questions on topic, write clearly, concisely, and don't post diet calculations.

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Honey
Honey
February 28, 2019 23:21

Bro I am a powerlifter and currently 19 years and 184cm. FFMI score is 21.7
Weight- 80kg with 10%b.f. Lifting experience is 2 years.
Bench press – 110kg
Squat- 100kg
Deadlift- 160kg
Question is can I get a 100kg stage ready physique Naturally?
Also what about 200kg bench naturally?? as I never stuck a plateau in any time till now.
What about at men’s physique category Olympia stage?

Adam Yates
Adam Yates
October 9, 2018 21:00

I find this interesting, I scored 28, I’m 1.85m tall and 120kg at 19.7% bf (measured last night with digital calipers). I know I am a genetic freak but I only started lifting again 9-10months ago. I’ve been on and off over the years but I’d argue my genetics are probably better than even Arnold’s. I have 32 inch quads, a 55 inch chest and 19 inch arms completely natural after 10 months. 12 months ago I weighed 25 kilos less. My transformation pics are on Instagram under @adam_yates_physique if it interests any of you. I’m planning on taking this as far as I can and defo got my eye on the prize with pushing my genetic limits. I want to enter the IFBB completely natural and prove everyone wrong that steroids are not the be all and end all of bodybuilding!

Joe Franklin
Joe Franklin
August 13, 2018 12:09

I think the FFMI is really off base. 25 years ago I had an FFMI of 28 completely drug free. My main supplement was peanut butter. I was strong and fairly muscular, but really nothing special. By no means was I gifted. I had friends, who I would estimate would score higher than I did. If you check the scores, the FFMI really goes higher the more you weigh. SO, you can have a really high FFMI with a fairly high fat percentage. For instance someone who is 5 feet 9 inches and weighed 245 with 20% body fat would have a high score.

Josh
Josh
November 30, 2017 22:11

Hi, I’m 21 years old. 134kg well over weight at 34% bf but my fat free mass is 87.8kg. I am 183cm tall and have managed to increase my fat free mass while dropping body fat. What does this mean as this fat free mass is higher than the examples given? I seem to be able to make fast gains and I am 100% natural (fat is also coming off at a steady pace) will I keep gaining fat free mass or will it stop soon as my bf gets lower? Thank you

Carl Juneau, PhD
Carl Juneau, PhD
July 26, 2017 08:07

Great post! Been a while since I’ve seen anyone add to this discussion in a meaningful way. I’ll share in this week’s bodybuilding science review newsletter.

Cheers!

Hos Delgado
Hos Delgado
December 29, 2016 19:01

Andy, as far as I know, the very first known reference to anabolic steroids in a bodybuilding magazine is dated 1938 – in a magazine called Strength and Health, there is a letter addressed to the editor of Strength and Health. So there is a destinct possibility that in the late 40’s there might have been some experimentation kept strictly between the elite bodybuilders of the time.

Ref: Hoberman JM, Yesalis CE (1995). “The history of synthetic testosterone”. Scientific American 272 (2): 76–81. doi:10.1038/scientificamerican0295-76. PMID 7817189.

Matthias Flehl
Matthias Flehl
August 5, 2016 04:19

Are there studies or better formulas out there related to muscle growth respecting the age?

I mean there should be a tremendious difference in building muscles between a joung boy starting with 15 years and a men starting with 30 or 40 or 60 years when they work out in similar intensity and all other conditions like nutrition, sleep and stress are the same.

George
George
June 16, 2016 15:51

I also forgot to give a massive thank you as I was originally 90kg and managed to lose 6kg using your cutting calculator and principles leaned from your site over a 4 month period. (Intermittent fasting and carb cycling). I had the added bonus of some abs for the first time in my life too 😉

George
George
June 16, 2016 15:30

I’m sorry but I refuse to believe these figures. I’ve been working out on and off for a few years but only serioisly in the past year. I’m 5’10 and 86kg with about 10% Bf (Jackson pollock method) . I believe I am still a beginner in terms of lifting weight as my squat is only 110kg and benching 90kg on the 5×5 program. I’m still gaining strength and size each month. I have always been a bit heaver than other people my size and build even before starting working out but I have small wrists and ankles and am not big boned. Anyway these calculations mean that I am at the upper end of my limits which is totally ridiculous!

Trent
Trent
January 18, 2016 13:42

Hi Andy,
Many of the pages I found for adjusted FFMI added a coefficient for height; ie adjusted FFMI = FFMI + 6 x (height – 1.8).

I just had a read of the pubmed extract, and the ratio is REVERSED! 🙂

That is “We then added a slight correction of 6.3 x (1.80 m – height) to normalize these values to the height of a 1.8-m man”.

So the formulae for adjusted FFMI = LBM/(Height^2) + 6.3 x (1.8-Height).

In my case, LBM = 92kg and Height = 1.91m
therefore adjusted FFMI = 92/1.91^2 + 6.3 x (1.8-1.91)
= 24.52

much more reasonable than the suggested 26 which occurred when the coefficient ended up with a positive value adjustment.

🙂

Kind Regards,

Trent

Nathan
Nathan
May 26, 2016 05:53
Reply to  Trent

Trent, in the study text it’s actually 6.1, where the abstract 6.3 (likely a typo). Every online calculator I’ve found appears to get this wrong. Based on how I’m reading the study, the taller people had a higher FFMI, even with less muscle development, so their adjusted formula reduces the number for tall people and increases it for short people. They explain this by pointing out that taller people are usually also wider/thicker, and the standard FFMI formula is 2-dimensional, not 3-dimensional. I’d love to know where all this went wrong. Since most online calculators seem to use the same source code, one mistake seems to have been copied quite a number of times.

Trent
Trent
January 18, 2016 07:10

Thanks Andy,
I note though, the adjusted FFMI suggests adding to the index for heights above 1.8m.. ie adjusted is FFMI + 6*(height-1.8).. In my case, this takes my current 25 up to 26…

I’ll have a DEXA done in a couple of weeks to make sure my numbers on BF% & LBM are correct… but i’m unlikely to have bf >12%, being i’m only 13 weeks post comp (INBA physique) and haven’t been binging or on a massive surplus….

Has anyone ever calculated a formulae for muscle mass index, ie maximum genetic potential of muscle mass based on height, size, bone density etc?

Perhaps this will be a good question for Eric Helms (he’s co-presenting camps with Layne Norton in Sydney this April, I’m lucky enough to have gotten a place to attend)..

Thanks again.

Trent.

Trent
Trent
January 15, 2016 08:19

HI Andy,
Nice article and a good read in the comments too – it’s great to see your engagement with your readers and fans!

Anyway, on the FFMI; is there a way to “adjust for height” for tall blokes?

I’m 191cm, and run a LBM of 92kg at the moment; that’s a FFMI of 25.2..
100% natty, 35 years old and training for only 3 years.

I wouldn’t call myself genetically gifted, growing up as a very skinny, lanky kid & teen.. Whilst my 3 years of lifting has seen me reach half-decent lift 1RM results (Sq 185kg, Dead 245kg, Bench 120kg)..

I still have a good number of years ahead of me and still have room to grow.

I think part of the problem with the formulae is no coefficient for bone density/mass – especially as a taller person further builds on this through compound lifting..

Keep up the great work – btw your page helped me with my first introduction to training back 3 years ago.. Links from Fitocracy brought me to your site, and I used your training recommendations in hand with IF to hit sub 9% for the first time in 2013..

Victor
Victor
September 5, 2015 09:39

I don’t believe the guy in the example is or could be natural.
All the point made in this article, as well as in the Eric Helms one, is based in the assumption that the FFMI of the Mr Americas is remotley acurate which i don’t think is the case.
Look at the FFMI of John Grimek: it goes from 24 to 26.9 in the timespam of one year. Assuming he is 1,75 tall, he would have gained 9kg (20lbs) of lean mass in that time. 9kg of muscle in one year is a great acomplishment for a begginer, it’s just impossible to put that much in one year (or at all) on top of an already Mr America winning physique.
Also, if you look at photos of these guys, for example Steeve Reeves and Jack Delinger side by side (https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-0ADfy0vRAuI/TpE5sTE9TpI/AAAAAAAADuY/vss7UIDche4/s1600/one.jpg), they look they have the same degree of muscularity. There’s no way one FFMI is 23 and the other 28.
These FFMI of former Mr Americas are completely urreliable to draw any valid conclusion.
A FFMI of 25 is actually great in real life (outside the internet). Its someone with very good genetics who trained hard for years, someone that look big to most people and will be acused of juicing frequently. Most wont reach a FFMI of 25 naturally. There should be some freaks capable of reaching 26, but more than that? I don’t buy into it, specially considering how financially and professionay rewarding is to be a fake natural bodybuilder, trainer or youtuber nowadays.

I agree with Casey Butt when he says : “The truth is 20 pounds of real, permanent muscle would transform your body. Most magazines and websites make it seem like 20 pounds of muscle is nothing …like your grandmother could gain that much. The reality is, if you gain 20 pounds of muscle this year everyone will notice and they’ll probably whisper behind your back that you’re on steroids – my friends did and I didn’t gain nearly that much in any one year. Gain 30 pounds of muscle (above your normal, healthy adult weight) and you’ll be carrying as much muscle as a world-class drug-free bodybuilder.”

Victor
Victor
September 5, 2015 22:16
Reply to  Andy Morgan

Andy, while i don’t agree completely i can see tour points.

You are right about the variability of the conditioning these guys presented at contest day. The carb intake and short use of very high volume in the weeks prior to competition sure could have an effect on lean mass. But 20lbs would be more what a fighter varies in lean mass with weight-in dehydratation. Still possible, just not likely in my opinion.
It’s just that one would expect that the top genetic gifted individuals, with no access to drugs, training with the same goal, would end up somewhat in the same ballpark of muscle mass. But the values vary so much, even in the same individual, that makes me very suspicious of the acuraccy of the measurements. Also because i don’t see that crazy variation in old photos or videos. But i could be wrong.

Let just forget the number aspect for a moment. The old school guys had a very different look, this is not only a matter of body fat percentage, you didn’t see the “full muscle”, “thin skin” pumped look. Look at Clancy Ross: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VCdnLTHSi8. Acording to the chart, his FFMI is over 26, even then doesnt have “that look”.

I agree that there are many individuals that refuse to pull the fake natty routine due to their morals. Unfortunetly these guys are often the guys who have their advice discredited as trainers because they are being compared to drug assisted standards of muscle mass, or are the guys losing a natural bodybuilding competition because they are competing against users.

Just as a closing thought: I live in Brazil, fitness is a big thing here , lots of gyms, so a very large talent pool. But at the same time, while selling steroids is a crime here, the possession is not, and its not as much seem as a morally reproved thing as in some other countries, and even some supplement sponsored competitors admit using. So here people talk more openly about it, and people are more realistic about what can and can’t be achived naturally. Its interesting that here you almost don’t see these huge naturals genetic freaks that appear so frequently in the US.

Fest
Fest
August 6, 2015 06:28

Hey, sorry for offtopic but could you tell me what comment system are you using? Btw. great blog 🙂

Ark
Ark
July 31, 2015 03:49

Hi Andy,

I couldn’t find an option to leave a comment for the latest complete diet guide with pdf. Just want to thank you hugely!!
All my friends are abusing printers now to get it on paper:) And this is Super Cool!

Thanks again. Your web site is getting into perfection inevitably:)

Ark

P.S. Are you planing to do something similar for the training guide by any chance?

Ark
Ark
July 31, 2015 21:25
Reply to  Andy Morgan

Will do! Please keep us posted when Eric”s text version will come out!
Hope you will be enjoying the rest of the summer!

Ark

Seth
Seth
July 28, 2015 20:54

Andy, thanks for the ideas. I am going to be starting my bulk on August 1, so I will be taking in more food for sure, and will change up my workout to see if I can find something that will work better during this bulk. Since I was on my cut for summer, I have just focused on going heavy, but I think I kept volume to high when I should not have. I guess for me, it just takes about 1.5 – 2 hours of lifting before I start feeling fatigued, or like I am hitting a wall…..

Seth
Seth
July 28, 2015 03:59

Hey Andy,
So Kim you are saying is natural, even w/ the amt. of definition he has? I mean those quads are insane.

I guess for me, I am just getting to the point where I am disheartened/frustrated.
I am 6’1″ (lanky, very small wrists and ankles), been lifting since I was 17 yrs old, I am 37 now.
I did a lot of basketball, volleyball and stuff in my 20’s and late teens.
And since 2013, I have started IF as well as really giving my workout sessions 100% energy and focus.
But it just seems like I will never get to ~180 lbs, w/ <8% BF
And my high end weight lifting seems to be limited by my joints at this point. Once I start going heavy, then I start feeling it in my joints.

Looking at some posts by Gregory, perhaps I need to back off my workouts some…
He seems to do 3x/week.

Worth a try I guess.

dan
dan
July 21, 2015 01:53

hi andy. just wondered do you just give clients cals and macros to follow or specific meal plans? also still a little confused on progressive overload. if load increases but volume decreases is that overload? many thanks

Da Cruz
Da Cruz
July 16, 2015 08:23

Hey andy. How should my macros look if i choose eating maintence?

If my i need 2k “calories for coma” x the factor ( 1.5 for example ) and also eating 20% plus in the days i train and 20% less in the days i rest. How many protein and fat should i eat? i know the rules for the macros on cutting and bulking but not for maintence.

Can you tell me? and things i’ve said are right?

Thanks and great article!

Mario
Mario
July 10, 2015 05:46

Awesome work Andy, one of the best articles I’ve read on the topic! In the past I’ve mainly used Casey Butt’s calculator as made some great points in his “Your Muscular Potential” book.

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